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	<title>Comments for Existential Type</title>
	<atom:link href="http://existentialtype.wordpress.com/comments/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://existentialtype.wordpress.com</link>
	<description>Abstract types are existential types.</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Tue, 29 Jan 2013 15:10:50 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>Comment on More Is Not Always Better by Robert Harper</title>
		<link>http://existentialtype.wordpress.com/2013/01/28/more-is-not-always-better/#comment-1143</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Robert Harper]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 Jan 2013 15:10:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://existentialtype.wordpress.com/?p=797#comment-1143</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Oh, bah, well express it in set theory, the point is the same.  (Fixed, btw.)]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh, bah, well express it in set theory, the point is the same.  (Fixed, btw.)</p>
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		<title>Comment on More Is Not Always Better by Andrej Bauer</title>
		<link>http://existentialtype.wordpress.com/2013/01/28/more-is-not-always-better/#comment-1142</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Andrej Bauer]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 Jan 2013 13:20:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://existentialtype.wordpress.com/?p=797#comment-1142</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[And just another remark. There are external statements which all hold but their internal versions are incompatible. For example &quot;every function is computed by a Turing machine&quot; and &quot;every well-founded binary tree has a uniform bound&quot; are both true externally (assuming classical meta-theory), but internally they are Church&#039;s Thesis and the Fan Principle, recpectively. These contradict each other because in the presence of Church&#039;s Thesis the Kleene tree is well-founded and unbounded.

So, even if we think that &quot;more is better&quot;, we are faced with the question &quot;which more&quot;?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And just another remark. There are external statements which all hold but their internal versions are incompatible. For example &#8220;every function is computed by a Turing machine&#8221; and &#8220;every well-founded binary tree has a uniform bound&#8221; are both true externally (assuming classical meta-theory), but internally they are Church&#8217;s Thesis and the Fan Principle, recpectively. These contradict each other because in the presence of Church&#8217;s Thesis the Kleene tree is well-founded and unbounded.</p>
<p>So, even if we think that &#8220;more is better&#8221;, we are faced with the question &#8220;which more&#8221;?</p>
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		<title>Comment on More Is Not Always Better by Andrej Bauer</title>
		<link>http://existentialtype.wordpress.com/2013/01/28/more-is-not-always-better/#comment-1141</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Andrej Bauer]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 29 Jan 2013 11:51:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://existentialtype.wordpress.com/?p=797#comment-1141</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[The theory of a real closed field is a first-order theory with equality whose language consists of 0, 1, +, *. This theory cannot express the fact &quot;the field is countable&quot;, as far as I can tell. How would you do that? So I think you chose a bad example there.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The theory of a real closed field is a first-order theory with equality whose language consists of 0, 1, +, *. This theory cannot express the fact &#8220;the field is countable&#8221;, as far as I can tell. How would you do that? So I think you chose a bad example there.</p>
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		<title>Comment on About by Robert Harper</title>
		<link>http://existentialtype.wordpress.com/about/#comment-1140</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Robert Harper]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 Jan 2013 18:04:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://existentialtype.wordpress.com/?page_id=62#comment-1140</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[thank you!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>thank you!</p>
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		<title>Comment on About by Vijay Ganesh</title>
		<link>http://existentialtype.wordpress.com/about/#comment-1139</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Vijay Ganesh]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 Jan 2013 18:33:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://existentialtype.wordpress.com/?page_id=62#comment-1139</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Dear Professor Harper,

I recently stumbled upon your blog. I read many of the articles there, and was particularly impressed by the &quot;Holy Trinity&quot; article. It is beautifully crafted, as if a word-smith has gone to work.

My own background is in logic, although more recently I have been devoting increasing amount of my time to types.

Coming back to your article, I was surprised not to see complexity theory mentioned. It is our best attempt at understanding computation through the lens of cost. 

I guess your reasons could have been that complexity theory itself can be interpreted using logic.

Anyways, thanks for a very inspiring post which has great clarity of thought.

-Vijay.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dear Professor Harper,</p>
<p>I recently stumbled upon your blog. I read many of the articles there, and was particularly impressed by the &#8220;Holy Trinity&#8221; article. It is beautifully crafted, as if a word-smith has gone to work.</p>
<p>My own background is in logic, although more recently I have been devoting increasing amount of my time to types.</p>
<p>Coming back to your article, I was surprised not to see complexity theory mentioned. It is our best attempt at understanding computation through the lens of cost. </p>
<p>I guess your reasons could have been that complexity theory itself can be interpreted using logic.</p>
<p>Anyways, thanks for a very inspiring post which has great clarity of thought.</p>
<p>-Vijay.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Exceptions are shared secrets by Robert Harper</title>
		<link>http://existentialtype.wordpress.com/2012/12/03/exceptions-are-shared-secrets/#comment-1138</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Robert Harper]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Dec 2012 21:08:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://existentialtype.wordpress.com/?p=782#comment-1138</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I don&#039;t see why.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t see why.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Exceptions are shared secrets by Mike Sperber (@sperbsen)</title>
		<link>http://existentialtype.wordpress.com/2012/12/03/exceptions-are-shared-secrets/#comment-1137</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Mike Sperber (@sperbsen)]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Dec 2012 20:33:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://existentialtype.wordpress.com/?p=782#comment-1137</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Sorry about &quot;switcheroo&quot;: My knowledge of the semantics of that word is mostly from Gödel, Escher, Bach (and Wikipedia).

I agree that compositionality would be nice: But the problem is that the wildcard handlers already destroy the compositionality - or at least those aspects of it I care about. It just doesn&#039;t seem that what&#039;s left is important enough to focus on the secrecy.

Moreover, more often than not, at least in my code, exceptions aren&#039;t a communication channel between two places in the code that share a binding, but rather a broadcast from one place in the code that ends up in another piece of code that was developed separately and without knowledge of the other. Providing a protocol for communication in that setting is more important than secrecy. Unfortunately, SML&#039;s exceptions make providing a rich, shared protocol pretty difficult.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry about &#8220;switcheroo&#8221;: My knowledge of the semantics of that word is mostly from Gödel, Escher, Bach (and Wikipedia).</p>
<p>I agree that compositionality would be nice: But the problem is that the wildcard handlers already destroy the compositionality &#8211; or at least those aspects of it I care about. It just doesn&#8217;t seem that what&#8217;s left is important enough to focus on the secrecy.</p>
<p>Moreover, more often than not, at least in my code, exceptions aren&#8217;t a communication channel between two places in the code that share a binding, but rather a broadcast from one place in the code that ends up in another piece of code that was developed separately and without knowledge of the other. Providing a protocol for communication in that setting is more important than secrecy. Unfortunately, SML&#8217;s exceptions make providing a rich, shared protocol pretty difficult.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Exceptions are shared secrets by Robert Harper</title>
		<link>http://existentialtype.wordpress.com/2012/12/03/exceptions-are-shared-secrets/#comment-1136</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Robert Harper]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Dec 2012 17:51:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://existentialtype.wordpress.com/?p=782#comment-1136</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[(A &quot;switcheroo&quot; is a swindle.)

The reason for secrecy is compositionality.  Say I&#039;m a higher order function.  I don&#039;t want to accidentally intercept an exception from the function I call just because I happen to use the same name as one used by the (black box) called function. Hence the need for secrecy.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>(A &#8220;switcheroo&#8221; is a swindle.)</p>
<p>The reason for secrecy is compositionality.  Say I&#8217;m a higher order function.  I don&#8217;t want to accidentally intercept an exception from the function I call just because I happen to use the same name as one used by the (black box) called function. Hence the need for secrecy.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Exceptions are shared secrets by Mike Sperber (@sperbsen)</title>
		<link>http://existentialtype.wordpress.com/2012/12/03/exceptions-are-shared-secrets/#comment-1135</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Mike Sperber (@sperbsen)]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 Dec 2012 15:37:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://existentialtype.wordpress.com/?p=782#comment-1135</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I did not mean to imply that you neglected or hid anything, merely that I don&#039;t follow your argument. I agree with the reasoning in your comment, so it seems the conclusion is that wildcard handlers break compositionality. Once that is lost, I don&#039;t understand why &quot;not reaching an unintended handler&quot; still buys you much.

I&#039;d characterize exceptions differently: Exceptions form a communication protocol. For this, the &quot;shared&quot; is much more important than the &quot;secret&quot;. I don&#039;t find a compelling rationale for the &quot;secret&quot; either in your post or in the Book.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I did not mean to imply that you neglected or hid anything, merely that I don&#8217;t follow your argument. I agree with the reasoning in your comment, so it seems the conclusion is that wildcard handlers break compositionality. Once that is lost, I don&#8217;t understand why &#8220;not reaching an unintended handler&#8221; still buys you much.</p>
<p>I&#8217;d characterize exceptions differently: Exceptions form a communication protocol. For this, the &#8220;shared&#8221; is much more important than the &#8220;secret&#8221;. I don&#8217;t find a compelling rationale for the &#8220;secret&#8221; either in your post or in the Book.</p>
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		<title>Comment on PFPL is out! by Vlad Lopatin</title>
		<link>http://existentialtype.wordpress.com/2012/12/03/pfpl-is-out/#comment-1134</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Vlad Lopatin]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 07 Dec 2012 14:38:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://existentialtype.wordpress.com/?p=780#comment-1134</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Ordered it.  Amazon sais that it&#039;s available December 31.  Which is ok either way - will get it right after the holidays.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ordered it.  Amazon sais that it&#8217;s available December 31.  Which is ok either way &#8211; will get it right after the holidays.</p>
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